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Picked this up. Thoughts?

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clarkaim
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Picked this up. Thoughts?

#1 Post by clarkaim » Sat Dec 15, 2018 9:25 pm

Got it for a good price for sure. I got it home, ran a jag thru the bore and the following observations: Bore is clean w/ crisp rifling. It appears numbers matching, w/ the exception of some #'s on underside of sight, but those don't appear to be Ser.#'s. See pic. Nose cap, receiver, Bolt all same #. I am taking apart tomorrow to see if there is a number in stock. The stock is finished in a dark brown, almost black w/ a shiny polished appearance. I intend to strip it down and refinish w/ BLO and walnut stain UNLESS one of ya'll tell me this is some special parade or Buckingham palace guard finish, and before I mung something up in my ignorance, wanted to check with some folks like you that may know something I don't. Here is why I even ask. The metal on this 1916 rifle does not betray that it was in any way abused or used in any conflict. The metal is also lacking in all the tell-tale arsenal stamps, proofs or what nots indicating any re-arsenal, etc. It's in pretty nice shape, even pristine, stock not withstanding. I just want to make sure the finish is not proper before I strip it and potentially ruin a rifle that is supposed to look this way, which if it is "sporterized" or whateverk, is actually done pretty well. Enfields are NOT my area of expertise, thus I ask you. Attachment 3324055Attachment 3324057Attachment 3324067Attachment 3324069Attachment 3324071Please advise?

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Re: Picked this up. Thoughts?

#2 Post by Airforce1 » Sat Dec 15, 2018 11:17 pm

Try re-uploading your picture.

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Re: Picked this up. Thoughts?

#3 Post by Alan De Enfield » Sun Dec 16, 2018 6:37 am

If the pictures are a true representation then the finish on the furniture is not correct but it is up to you if you want to remove it and 'start again'.
(Maybe some ones idea of a 'shiny black rifle')
20181215_145408.jpg


Not wishing to teach your granny to suck eggs - but you do say that Enfields are not your area of expertise.

Do you know the correct order of disassembly ?

I reckon as many Lee Enfield's have been damaged by over enthusiastic collectors as were lost in WW1. (slight 'eggs-aggeration')

There is a square ended bolt in the Butt which attaches thru' the Butt Socket and into the forend furniture. - so - the forend MUST be removed first trying to remove the Butt first means that the forend will be split and made useless.

Remove all of the forend 'bits and pieces' (trigger guard, nose piece etc etc) then get (make) a U shaped piece of wood that just straddles the action, gently tap this downwards to break the forend out of the 'draws'.

NEVER NEVER pull the forend down at the muzzle end it will destroy the draws.

When you come to remove the butt, you will need a long, wide flat bladed screwdriver and a metal wire coat hanger (or similar piece of stiff wire)

The Butt-Bolt SHOULD (unless bubba has lost it) have a leather washer sat on top of the bolt head (this is to stop the oil bottle rattling). This leather washer needs 'fishing out' with your bit of wire with a 'hook' on the end, before you can remove the Butt stock bolt.

The butt bolt should be "Gorrilla" tight so may take some shifting - I use a square shafted screwdriver with the handle cut-off and a suitable socket and ratchet to move it.

Once the bolt is out you should find 1 or 2 steel washers - make sure you don't lose them, and make sure you replace them when re-assembling. The 'flat washer' goes in 1st, and if there is a split-spring washer, this sits on top of the flat washer.
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Re: Picked this up. Thoughts?

#4 Post by 72 usmc » Sun Dec 16, 2018 1:27 pm

On a Mac all I see is this:
Attachment 3324055Attachment 3324057Attachment 3324067Attachment 3324069Attachment 3324071Please advise?
no pics?
To old to fight and to old to run, a Jar head will just shoot and be done with you.

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Re: Picked this up. Thoughts?

#5 Post by Tommy Atkins » Mon Dec 17, 2018 11:37 am

That's an "Interesting" take on stock finish.
Could the stamps have been scrubbed during the "improvements"

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Re: Picked this up. Thoughts?

#6 Post by clarkaim » Fri Jan 11, 2019 12:45 am

20181215_142519.jpg
20181215_142519.jpg
20181215_142519.jpg
20181215_142519.jpg
20181215_145535.jpg
20181215_145503.jpg
20181215_145503.jpg
20181215_145503.jpg
here are more pics
Attachments
20181215_145408.jpg
20181215_142550.jpg

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Re: Picked this up. Thoughts?

#7 Post by vandle » Fri Jan 11, 2019 1:42 am

Nice pickup

Not a fan of the finish of the stock :lol:
Remove the finish and oil her up.
When you pull the furniture apart you should see the original colour.
I wouldnt worry about staining it, it should come up nice with the oil
on its own.

my 5 cents
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Re: Picked this up. Thoughts?

#8 Post by Spavac » Sat Jan 12, 2019 9:52 am

Ya, I think the "brown/black paint" definitely needs to go! I can't really imagine why anyone would do that? Pretty sure that the Buckingham Palace Guards would have done a better job of it, IDK. I suppose I could have been used as a ceremonial rifle (i.e Color Guard) by a Brit equivalent of the VFW or American Legion. It's interesting that the OP describes the metalwork's pristine condition. I'm not an expert on WWI but would think that a Lee Enfield rifle made in 1916 would have seen, at least, some duty during that war.
As Alan de Enfield recommended, use caution when disassembling the LE so as not to damage components. This rifle could well be a "diamond in the rough". It wasn't mentioned where it was purchased or what was paid for it but if it was from a private party and super cheap, it could be due to it NOT being mechanically sound (i.e. safe). I'd have it checked out by a professional or someone very familiar with Lee Enfields before shooting it.
Oh, it's usually prudent to click the "Full Editor & Preview" button to proof posts and replies. Multiples of photos do nothing but take up space ;-)!
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Re: Picked this up. Thoughts?

#9 Post by indy1919a4 » Sat Jan 12, 2019 1:19 pm

Spavac wrote:
Sat Jan 12, 2019 9:52 am
Ya, I think the "brown/black paint" definitely needs to go! I can't really imagine why anyone would do that? Pretty sure that the Buckingham Palace Guards would have done a better job of it,
Yeah I do not think it is a Buckingham Palace Guard gun, because I am sure that is one of those rifles. Its much different. :D

Image

Image

I have been told that the true sign is the Franklin Half dollar in the stock.. I guess the guards
are nicknamed Franklins??? :lol:

Image

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Re: Picked this up. Thoughts?

#10 Post by Spavac » Sat Jan 12, 2019 7:10 pm

indy1919a4 wrote:
Sat Jan 12, 2019 1:19 pm
Spavac wrote:
Sat Jan 12, 2019 9:52 am
Ya, I think the "brown/black paint" definitely needs to go! I can't really imagine why anyone would do that? Pretty sure that the Buckingham Palace Guards would have done a better job of it,
Yeah I do not think it is a Buckingham Palace Guard gun, because I am sure that is one of those rifles. Its much different. :D

Image

Image

I have been told that the true sign is the Franklin Half dollar in the stock.. I guess the guards
are nicknamed Franklins??? :lol:

Image
So, are you saying the one in the photos IS a Buckingham Palace Guard ceremonial LE? If it is AND it's yours, how did you come by it? Obviously, its in pristine condition but I must say that it's a little too bling'd out for me. Are all of the metal components chromed? The lighting on the photos seems to give a "brassy" color to some of the metalwork. Thanks for sharing :D !
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Re: Picked this up. Thoughts?

#11 Post by indy1919a4 » Sat Jan 12, 2019 7:48 pm

Spavac wrote:
Sat Jan 12, 2019 7:10 pm

So, are you saying the one in the photos IS a Buckingham Palace Guard ceremonial LE? If it is AND it's yours, how did you come by it? Obviously, its in pristine condition but I must say that it's a little too bling'd out for me. Are all of the metal components chromed? The lighting on the photos seems to give a "brassy" color to some of the metalwork. Thanks for sharing :D !
Spavac
Hey I like that, limited Edition.. yeah thats the ticket..

It is all mine, it is chrome and all paid for, no bank loan to pay off on this little baby. Dated 1916 then on the other side it has 1926 Date with a "R broad arrow F". Got that at an auction. It needed love. It was like finding a 3 legged puppy. And may I say it still shoots.. The Bore is pretty nice..

No Brass, lets see if a brown background will gets a better photo. There are some rubbing on parts of the chrome.

Image

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Re: Picked this up. Thoughts?

#12 Post by Spavac » Sat Jan 12, 2019 9:41 pm

indy1919a4 wrote:
Sat Jan 12, 2019 7:48 pm
Spavac wrote:
Sat Jan 12, 2019 7:10 pm

So, are you saying the one in the photos IS a Buckingham Palace Guard ceremonial LE? If it is AND it's yours, how did you come by it? Obviously, its in pristine condition but I must say that it's a little too bling'd out for me. Are all of the metal components chromed? The lighting on the photos seems to give a "brassy" color to some of the metalwork. Thanks for sharing :D !
Spavac
Hey I like that, limited Edition.. yeah thats the ticket..

It is all mine, it is chrome and all paid for, no bank loan to pay off on this little baby. Dated 1916 then on the other side it has 1926 Date with a "R broad arrow F". Got that at an auction. It needed love. It was like finding a 3 legged puppy. And may I say it still shoots.. The Bore is pretty nice..

No Brass, lets see if a brown background will gets a better photo. There are some rubbing on parts of the chrome.

Image
Well, to be sure, that's a Limited Edition variant of that rifle 8-) . You DO know that the "LE" in my reply meant Lee Enfield, right? :roll: LOL
The photo with the brown background does show the "chrome" a bit better. (And a few dings in the furniture too :( ). You've yet to mention the true provenance of this rifle. The R broad arrow F on the left side of the action certainly has significance. The broad arrow (according to a quick Google search) refers to ownership by the British government. I couldn't find a reference to the R and F perhaps the Royal Fusiliers? There's bound to be an Anglophile on the forum that's in the know.
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Re: Picked this up. Thoughts?

#13 Post by indy1919a4 » Sat Jan 12, 2019 9:56 pm

Spavac wrote:
Sat Jan 12, 2019 9:41 pm
. The R broad arrow F on the left side of the action certainly has significance. The broad arrow (according to a quick Google search) refers to ownership by the British government. I couldn't find a reference to the R and F perhaps the Royal Fusiliers? There's bound to be an Anglophile on the forum that's in the know.
Spavac
ha ha let us not be so grand here... from what I found this means the rifle took a trip to India and got reworked in 1926

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Re: Picked this up. Thoughts?

#14 Post by Spavac » Sun Jan 13, 2019 10:19 am

Now I'm a bit embarrassed and thinking that the coin in the stock should have been a "red flag". I'm pretty sure that no self-respecting Brit would EVER adorn ANYTHING with a likeness of Benjamin Franklin ;-)! So, 10 years after it was made it was shipped of to India for a "refurb"? I guess out-sourcing has been around for a while! I couldn't make out the date on the coin but the Franklin Half-Dollar coin wasn't minted until 1948 so that part of the "bling up" couldn't have occurred before then. I suppose the chrome plating of the metalwork could have occurred with the reworking while in India but don't know why that would have been done. The chrome plating prolly occurred later on in its life.
I have no idea why I'm so curious about the life of this rifle, I just am :-). Must be the dreary Winter here in Wisconsin.
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Re: Picked this up. Thoughts?

#15 Post by indy1919a4 » Sun Jan 13, 2019 10:43 am

Spavac wrote:
Sun Jan 13, 2019 10:19 am
I have no idea why I'm so curious about the life of this rifle, I just am :-). Must be the dreary Winter here in Wisconsin.
Spavac
The coin dates from 1951, Who ever chrome plated it had to have spent some money doing it.. My guess is a vfw honor guard or something of that flavor.

You are not the only one to express fascination. A couple of gun shops near me, that sell older guns wanted it just to hang on the walls for grins and giggles.

I think the fascination with it is like when you see a pretty young 20 year old girl at the beach...We dream of the possibilities and just look.

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