Well, the board is either fixed, or it's going to run terribly. Cross your fingers and hope for the best. I'm at my technical limit right now.

Springfield Armory M1 Carbine, Blowback CO2 .177cal BB Rifle

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72 usmc
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Re: Springfield Armory M1 Carbine, Blowback CO2 .177cal BB Rifle

#31 Post by 72 usmc » Thu Aug 08, 2019 9:12 pm

Just got my email the WOOD STOCK MODEL IS BACK IN STOCK AS OF 8 Aug 2019. :dance:
This should provide some better reviews\!
Per your request from 2019-07-22 we are letting you know that the following item:
Springfield Armory M1 Carbine, Blowback CO2 .177cal BB Rifle
http://www.pyramydair.com/s/m/Springfie ... gn=instock

is now in stock and ready for shipping.

If you are still interested in this item feel free to order it any time.

Thank you,
Pyramyd Air Sales
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Re: Springfield Armory M1 Carbine, Blowback CO2 .177cal BB Rifle

#32 Post by 72 usmc » Sun Aug 11, 2019 10:08 am

Airgun papa has an interesting and informative review:

How to transform the Springfield M1 sight to an elevation & windage adjustable for about 27 + shipping depending on who you order from.
Things I would have changed: The non-adjustable peep can be replaced. I bought a KENSIGHT ADJUSTABLE REAR SIGHT ASSEMBLY for the standard centerfire M-1 carbine. I took out the adjustable ramped elevation assembly from this sight and put in place of the CO2 Springfield Armory non-adjustable ramp assembly. It fits right in as the windage adjustment screw is the same diameter with the same thread pitch. You need to use the Springfield Armory windage adjustment assembly screw, end nut and keeper and use a 1/16" diameter ball bearing for the tensioner part that is located in the bottom of the elevation adjustable ramp and it works perfectly.
source PA review
comment I assume he means the original M1 carbine, Kensight base ball bearing is utilized on the BB rifle, not that one has to hunt down a new additional 1/16 ball bearing to complete the job????? This is unclear to me since I do not have a rifle in hand.


Kensight link: https://stores.kensight.com/m1-carbine- ... ear-sight/
also Midway, Brownells & Amazon prices vary $26-40, cheeper than originals that go for $50-70 bucks.
Screen Shot 2019-08-11 at 9.11.37 AM.png
Screen Shot 2019-08-11 at 9.11.50 AM.png
Screen Shot 2019-08-11 at 9.11.02 AM.png
Kensight Adjustable Rear Sight Assembly M1 Carbine Steel Matte with Peep Aperture
Product #: 775265 Kensight #: 860-102 UPC #: 755377861029
Kensight Adjustable Rear Sight Assembly M1 Carbine Steel Matte with Peep Aperture
$26.99


SPRINGFIELD M1 CARBINE REAR SIGHTSPRINGFIELD M1 CARBINE REAR SIGHT
SPECS
High Quality Reproduction Of The Factory Original

Modern, high-quality reproduction of the original rear sight makes restoring your M1 carbine easier and the final job look authentic. Patterned after the factory rear sight using modern CAD/CAM design techniques and wire EDM cut from 4140 bar stock for tight tolerances. Features audible clicks for precise windage adjustment and preset range increments for elevation adjustment.

Thank you Air gun papa for a great informative review at PA. :dance:

Notice the difference between an original M1 carbine sight adjustment screw & nut and the Cheep Springfield M1 carbine sight adjustment screw that must be retained to make a switch to an elevation & windage adjustable sight from the "guts" of the Kensight. That end nut is very different from the original. You can not just switch complete sight assemblies because the base mounts are very different on each rifle. The mount notch is a different shape & maybe a different size, hence you best just use the central ramp assy. or "guts" from the reproduction Kensight. I have not actually done this to the Springfield carbine. I am relying on the review instructions. I hope to get a later model and maybe put an early flipper sight onto mine if they produce a paratrooper version next year.
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Last edited by 72 usmc on Sun Aug 11, 2019 7:53 pm, edited 4 times in total.
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Re: Springfield Armory M1 Carbine, Blowback CO2 .177cal BB Rifle

#33 Post by 72 usmc » Sun Aug 11, 2019 10:40 am

If you read James' review at Airgun Depot and Airgun papa's review at Pyramyd Air- both had issues with the magazine spring jumping out of the magazines. Both provide repair solutions & needs for adjustments to the magazine to function. So the Springfields M1 magazine is problematic. For $35 each, I'd send the defective mag back Asap. It must be luck of the draw or cheaply made Chinese junk lacking attention to details & functionality. At this early time, the magazine is so far the worst manufacturing problem reported with this model. Added 19 Aug : as reviews come in it appears the magazine is a bag of worms. Few have concerns with the rifle itself, except for the rear sight! That is good.

James indicates;
...the magazine spring jumped out of the raceway through the widened locking slot for the follower tab for the first two attempts at pulling it back to load. I had to drive out the pin at the bottom of the housing and remove the lower guide to get the spring free to replace it. It jumped again. The second time I noted the spring was arching up during compression and the coils were catching on the edge of this widened area so I smoothed out the edges and the problem was solved.
Airgun Papa indicates:
To fix the problem with the magazine spring jumping out of the raceway, I drove out the pin at the bottom of the housing and removed the lower guide and replaced the spring. I noted the spring was arching up during compression and the coils were catching on the edge of this widened area. I smoothed out the edges and the problem was solved. Also, the upper hand guard was loose and rattled badly. I removed the fore-end furniture and put some rubber material at the rear edges of the handguard that fit under the receiver ring and a second piece at the forward end. This provided a snug fit and ended the rattle.
And Nick in a PA review had slightly different problems with the magazines:
The magazine that came with the gun broke immediately, the BB pusher needed to be repaired. I ordered a spare magazine and after the first CO2 cartridge the seal came out with the empty cylinder. I had to glue it back. So I've had issues with the magazines, both I was able to fix but still had problems. I hope this was a unique circumstance as I really like the gun.
Joverton indicates:
My mags leaked to! They're leaking around the screw in cap! will be contacting PA!
So there are some issues with leaking seals or possible the rifle is C02 cartridge specific like other some other BB guns. Try different C02 cartridges. The Umarex seem to work best. Problematic are the cheeper Crossman cartridges in non USA BB guns. Also, be sure to use some Pelloil on the seal. Stick to one brand because after long use it imprints a ring on the seal from the correct size for the cartridge tip and switching brands can cause leakage due to different size tips/fits. No reviews state what C02 cartridges they are utilizing in the situations that leak. I use one of these as the first cartridge on a new air gun to lube the insides: ASG Ultrair 12-Gram CO2 Lubrication Cartridges, then follow up with the Umarex brand. A CO2 gun depends on its rubber O ring like seals to hold in the gas. These C02 seals as well as other internal seals need a thin luberication to stay soft & receive less wear. Pelloil is great as well as Luberication C02 cartridges. Special airgun Silicone oil the best. Also, I never let a cartridge sit in the gun after use. Take it out so the seal does not get a crushed down imprint from the cartridge tip. Never leave it sit in an airgun for long term storage, really bad for a seal.
There are two problematic points where the C02 valves in an air gun can leak. The first spot is the O ring like seal in the C02 holder/magazine where the C02 cartridge is pushed in, pierces the cartridge seal, and is held against the seal allowing air to enter the gun. The second spot is the valve stem seal that releases air to the transfer port orifice that drives the projectile down the barrel. When the trigger is pulled the rifle bolt or the pistol hammer hits this release valve pushing the metal or plastic stem in the seal and allowing the gas to enter the chamber/barrel. Both seals got to be in good condition & have Pelloil applied to a new air gun. Check all wear spots on the moving parts. Some guns arrive dry out of the box and a wee bit of silicon grease or Pelloil goes a long way in the lifespan of a less expensive $200 airgun.
Notice, few of the less expensive guns have seal repair kits offered. They want you to buy another $200 air gun :shhh:

Likewise Robert in a PA review said:
It looks great so real shoots great easy to load what more do you want I had a problem with the magazine spring called pyramydair they sent a new one also a good company to do you air gun buying.
Mark in a PA review had a problem of paint wear & fit:
One Item I would change is the magazines they began to chip and slip very quiclly.
Peter at PA also notes cheep paint: Not a real blue:
I would like if the paint used on the magazine could be more durable. Paint wore off after the first loading.
Stephen in a Pa review states:
Things I would have changed: the magazine is well done however the little piece of plastic that allows you load is very very bad, it breaks so easy..please replace this little piece and you will have a wonderful bb gun .
Ricardo at PA states:
I almost returned it because of BBs rolling down the barrel. However, after swapping magazines this issue almost disappeared. The magazine I was using had a broken follower and that may be the cause, lets see. It still happens sometimes, when two BBs are loaded or after loading the rifle (pulling and releasing the bolt on the first shot) and lowering the barrel. I did not give 5 stars because of this issue. The provided Allen key is 6mm not the normal 1/4.
I am having an issue with broken follower. This is the second magazine with this problem.
The first two are the Best 2 reviews so far for information (They may be the same person??? :think: )- a must to check out if you purchase a BB carbnine.
Can anyone provide some close up views of the magazine and this spring and maybe a photo of one where it came out of its tract?
Last edited by 72 usmc on Mon Aug 19, 2019 8:10 pm, edited 10 times in total.
To old to fight and to old to run, a Jar head will just shoot and be done with you.

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Re: Springfield Armory M1 Carbine, Blowback CO2 .177cal BB Rifle

#34 Post by 72 usmc » Sun Aug 11, 2019 6:47 pm

Some views of the M1 carbine magazine taken from on line sources, I am waiting to buy a later version of this carbine.I could not find close up views of the BB spring and slide edges. Notice how easily the finish comes off the magazine & rifle wear spots.
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Screen Shot 2019-08-11 at 5.40.19 PM.png
The side notches wear and cause problems engaging the magazine.
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The red arrow points to what must be the rough edge that causes the spring to pop out.
With so many already reported problems , I wonder if they plan a second revised generation magazine with improved edges and/or spring? It sounds like there are going to be plenty of returned magazines during the short 90 day warranty period.
To old to fight and to old to run, a Jar head will just shoot and be done with you.

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Re: Springfield Armory M1 Carbine, Blowback CO2 .177cal BB Rifle

#35 Post by 72 usmc » Sun Aug 11, 2019 7:39 pm

Here is a great view of the Taiwan Springfield M1 carbine's rear sight and odd sight adjustment screw & its nut unique to the BB reproduction rifle. Looks like everything was made as cheep as possible including the non functional sight ramp :arrow: I do like Airgun Papa's idea of switching parts so one has a functional sight on the wood model BB carbine. :clap: :dance: Perfection.

I would also remove or subdue the stinking white paint. Too bad the receiver marking is not stamped into the metal. I do not like the plastic stock, sorry, but it is nasty & cheep looking. OK, for a kids $100 bb rifle. I can not wait to see more reviews on the wood stock, since the wood stock model is being shipped out as I type. No reviews on disassembly or its action removed from the stock? I found out Airgun Papa is a airgun gunsmith that repairs vintage airguns & has many reviews of items sold at PA. Check out all his reviews- he knows what he is talking about.
Source PA web sight photo shot
Screen Shot 2019-08-11 at 6.35.48 PM.png
To old to fight and to old to run, a Jar head will just shoot and be done with you.

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Re: Springfield Armory M1 Carbine, Blowback CO2 .177cal BB Rifle

#36 Post by 72 usmc » Mon Aug 12, 2019 7:35 pm

Too many are asking. For information only.
For those that missed the earlier link. Some of the cheep reproductions have the wrong size metal end and do not fit. Here is the best quality reproduction sling & oiler. At the Front is great for WW II re-enactors goodies- best of the best. :dance: :whistle:
Screen Shot 2019-08-12 at 6.39.13 PM.png
source: At the Front photo

https://www.atthefront.com/WWII-M1-Carb ... swwcws.htm

I have not ordered this one, but here is the works- a package deal with everything for your BB carbine:
https://www.atthefront.com/product-p/uspkgm1c.htm

Remember: there are still no reports indicating if the larger & fatter airgun magazines actually fit a USGI carbine mag pouch. But even empty, they look great on a carbine. These reproductions are 1/1 for a USGI magazine fit. PLEASE -Someone with a rifle needs to try the fit for the airgun magazines. The Reproduction bayonet does fit the Springfield M1 BB carbine mount. Original USGI bayonets also fit, but are big bucks. I'd rather have a reproduction in case I lose it. A nice reproduction here. https://militaryantiquesmuseum.com/swor ... y-antiques
To old to fight and to old to run, a Jar head will just shoot and be done with you.

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Re: Springfield Armory M1 Carbine, Blowback CO2 .177cal BB Rifle

#37 Post by 72 usmc » Mon Aug 19, 2019 8:43 pm

Possible problems with Crosman Co2 cartridges
Various mags
You could keep in mind from Element two that I had difficulty loading quite a few distinct brands of CO2 cartridges into the magazine. They had been just also fat to match in very easily and I had a issue obtaining the initial one particular out following it was employed up. A single brand that was especially tricky to load was the Crosman cartridge. So, Tyler Patner from Pyramid Air sent me a distinct magazine, and I returned the magazine from this rifle, along with the Crosman cartridge that was also significant. That way he can see what I’ve observed and, if there is a issue, perhaps they can repair it. Tyler also sent me a new box of Crosman cartridges that I began today’s test with. There was no issue loading them into the new magazine. I do not believe you will expertise the very same issue I had, though if you do, Pyramyd Air now knows about it.
Source Tom Gaylord see SPRINGFIELD ARMORY M1 CARBINE BB GUN: ELEMENT THREE | AIR GUN WEBLOG
By Jonathan Blackmore - July 18, 2019
Link: https://survivalskillz.com/2019/07/18/s ... un-weblog/

More close up views of the problematic magazine. Photos from Baker Airguns. photo shots
Screen Shot 2019-08-19 at 7.31.29 PM.png
Screen Shot 2019-08-19 at 7.31.45 PM.png
springfield-armory-m1-carbine-bb-rifle-46.gif.jpeg
xxl_SA-M1CC4E-MAG_1.jpg
To old to fight and to old to run, a Jar head will just shoot and be done with you.

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Re: Springfield Armory M1 Carbine, Blowback CO2 .177cal BB Rifle

#38 Post by 72 usmc » Sat Aug 24, 2019 11:21 pm

Michael
1 day ago
Had two and returned them , both stopped functioning and going into battery after 10 shots . Mags didn’t lock up and dropped out of rifle when it did fire. Replacement rifle had spring literally fly out of mag when depressed to load. Fps for a rifle is pathetic and shares the award with Sig 365 for biggest disappointment of the year
a new review: not really up to 425 FPS, more like 325 FPS From Replica Arms

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QU5U60DUZ9I
To old to fight and to old to run, a Jar head will just shoot and be done with you.

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Re: Springfield Armory M1 Carbine, Blowback CO2 .177cal BB Rifle

#39 Post by 72 usmc » Fri Sep 06, 2019 11:15 am

PA has posted 31 reviews check them out. To their credit they do not edit them and let facts speak for themselves. readers are getting details piece by piece.

An interesting review on PA- Refurbished M1 firearms by an airgun gunsmith. Makes me think "caution" on returned stuff.
Also an interesting comment on the wood quality of the wood stock version.
Airgun Papa indicates:
Things I would have changed: The quality and finish of the wood. I had already purchased the faux wood rifle and when I saw the discounted wood version I bought that too. I am somewhat regretful in the second purchase. The wood stock is bland and has very little grain that lends any attraction to the stock and the faux wood stock is by far the more attractive of the two except for the weight it lends making the feel more authentic. Besides this the sling recess in the wood stock resembles being chiseled out by a novice with very rough tool marks and an uneven surface across the cut. The $100.00 difference in price is not merited by this sorry piece of wood. The so called "Refurbished" category of this gun is a farce: The BB follower of the magazine was broken into two pieces. The face seal of the magazine was very deformed. The slot of the screw at the tang was butchered by someone who tampered with it. It was evident the handguard band had been removed and the barrel shroud was scratched. The forend pin removed.
What others should know: Refurbished should be a product previously owned and returned and the faults corrected to meet factory standards. This gun was not refurbished, it was recycled in "as is" condition and had lots of faults and damage. The person who returned it should certainly have been penalised the 20% restocking fee. I acknowledge there should be some minor expected wear on a refurbished gun but not broken parts, marred screws and overall finish damage from some nitwit who obviously disassembled it. No doubt Pyramyd Air would have made good had I returned it with no cost to me had the previous damage been documented, but I could not know that it would not be attributed to me. Therefore I have chosen to repair the rifle and remedy the cosmetic damage myself as I have the professional skills to do so. Whomever was in charge of inspecting this product before it was put up for resale however, failed to do their job and sadly that reflects badly on Pyramyd which has provided excellent service in the past.

As I suspected, Jeffery's review provides confirmation about USGI or reproduction sling pouches not fitting the larger( taller & thicker) BB rifle M1 carbine magazines. Original stock pouches do not fit the Springfield BB magazines
Jeffery states:
Things I would have changed: !. The magazine spring needs to be modified, as mine kinked up, stretched out and popped out. I needed a new magazine. 2. Create a canvas stock two magazine pouch holder. The real M-1 carbine canvas magazine pouch is too small. I converted a 1950's M-2 30 round canvas magazine to fit my M-1 to hold two Springfield magazines.

Almost all reviewers comment on the magazine as garbage- a real design flaw. Tony's review is interesting and one of way too many about the mag problems:
The bolt would never close. I replaced the magazine and still had a problem which was probably due to the magazines not operating properly. I complained and was told the rifle was defective and to send it back which I did.
Things I would have changed: Redesign the magazines!
What others should know: Basically that's it. I think most of my problems were with the magazines but how are you suppose to judge the rifle if you can't fire it.
Ricardo in a recent review also had problems with his mags, but got replacements from PA's excellent service:
What others should know: I am having an issue with broken follower. This is the second magazine with this problem. However, it is nice to have Pyramyd excellent support to take care of you. I didnt give 5 stars because of this issue, it is a little part which makes the gun not working properly.
I see Pyramid Air is out of stock of the wood stock version, and Airgun Depot does not offer it. Neither show close up views of the wood stock. There are no pictures of its quality, or problems posted on line. :idea: :idea: :idea: PLEASE, Can an individual that owns a wood stock
model post some close up views of the M1 BB carbine stock - its finish, grain, fit, and tooling, for the readers. :pray: :pray: :pray:
It seems it is a $300 toy that fails to function when the mag self destructs.
To old to fight and to old to run, a Jar head will just shoot and be done with you.

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Re: Springfield Armory M1 Carbine, Blowback CO2 .177cal BB Rifle

#40 Post by 72 usmc » Wed Sep 11, 2019 3:53 pm

Pa now has 35 reviews; more magazine problems...

Steven indicates some interesting points:
Things I would have changed: I purchased the imitation wood. Unfortunately, this makes the rifle so ridiculously light and cheap feeling I just had to return it for the real wood version which I'm hoping will improve upon overall feel and quality of the rifle. Would you believe the clip is heavier by itself that the weight of the entire rifle? So yes, the imitation wood version is a quite cheap feeling rifle. I haven't seen the real wood version as of yet because it hasn't arrived. But if you're a fan of this particular rifle going back to the 1960's versions as I am, then spend the extra hundred for the real wood. I have a strong feeling it's the right choice.
What others should know: The BB follower inside the clip inexplicably broke after only a few uses. Now that black piece of plastic just slides up and down loosely. That really needs to be addressed. The top part of the rifle stock is loose for some reason. No screws to tighten or anything to stop it from jiggling. This also needs addressing. So, in a nutshell, an unbelievably accurate rifle given its price range. But has some quality control issues on the imitation version which I'm hoping aren't an issue on the real wood version.
Jeffery also had problems, but Pa must be sending out replacement mags like crazy. I wonder who pays shipping back or if they just send out a replacement mag?
As so many others mentioned, I too had the factory mag fail as explained in other reviews. But Pyramyd is right on top of replacing it as they always do. It would also be nice if elevation could be adjusted through either sight. I am lucky that mine is ok out of the box. But what if it wasn't?? A smaller aperture on the rear sight would be a plus also.
Another review under the spare mag:
the piece has one thing wrong the small piece of plastic that is used to move the bb's up to the top for firing..this piece breaks so easy ,,they should replace it
And more magazine function comments:
Things I would have changed: Magazine BB loading is difficult. There's very little mass on the BB pusher to grab and pull back, the spring is strong and gives a lot of resistance, and the hole to load the BBs is just barely the right size. When you set the pusher into locking position it just barely holds and easily displaces and has to be reset to finish loading. Since the BB hole is so tight it makes it hard to use a speed loader. I think an easier loading design would have been beneficial. The magazine is VERY heavy. A higher capacity magazine would be nice, maybe a 30 round?
What others should know: The magazine that came with the gun broke immediately, the BB pusher needed to be repaired. I ordered a spare magazine and after the first CO2 cartridge the seal came out with the empty cylinder. I had to glue it back. So I've had issues with the magazines, both I was able to fix but still had problems. I hope this was a unique circumstance as I really like the gun.
By Keith from USA on 2019-08-21
0 Comments
Thanks Nick for the info on the mags, and all other peoples reviews about the sub par mags. I was wondering if they would work properly. Mags seem to be problematic with air guns leaking jamming hard to load etc. I will hold off on purchase. Mag problems by this time shouldn't have any issues in my opinion. So sad Q. C. on mags isn't a concern with the air gun industry.
By joverton from USA on 2019-08-12
0 Comments
My mags leaked to! They're leaking around the screw in cap! will be contacting PA!
It seems a second model of the mag is being worked on to improve the rifle to perfection. I wonder if the old/early buyers will be sent replacement magazines free? I assume PA will let buyers know when this new improved mag arrives- better seals, better spring, smoother edges, and metal parts replace cheep plastic at the loading tab guide and attention to the magazine lock lugs so it snaps in better. No reports of worn lock lock lugs because the magazine fails to function before they are subjected to any long term use. :doh: :shifty:
Lawrence from USA asked:
Almost all reviewers report magazine problems. Will an improved, new designed magazine be offered by the manufacturer ? Who is the manufacturer of this carbine?
Mark from USA:
We have advised the manufacturer. WeTech from Taiwan. They say they will improve the magazine.
Odd, that they do not stop the sale of the rifle until an improved, functioning magazine appears on the market. Why pay $300 for a wood model (we still have no on line close up views of a wood stock version) for a BB rifle where the mag fails out of the box or within a few times of use.
We Tech should replace all the early version magazines or produce a parts kit to improve the seals and BB guide & spring for the suckers that purchased the carbine. Why would one buy a BB gun for $300 and then have to buy replacement magazines when the original goes bad. No wonder "We Tech" only offers only a 90 day warranty. :doh: :doh: :doh: :snooty: :snooty: A replacement mag is 35 bucks each plus shipping :!: :violin: Or an additional 70 + shipping (most will want at least 2 mags). CRAZY
Can anyone report how PA handles the replacement of a bad magazine or worse, for those that purchased 2 magazines and both are defective. Who pays shipping? How many times do they replace a broken magazine? Is the PA warranty good for a year?
Last edited by 72 usmc on Wed Sep 11, 2019 10:04 pm, edited 4 times in total.
To old to fight and to old to run, a Jar head will just shoot and be done with you.

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Re: Springfield Armory M1 Carbine, Blowback CO2 .177cal BB Rifle

#41 Post by 72 usmc » Wed Sep 11, 2019 4:21 pm

Is this the company that produced the Springfield BB carbine? I do not see it listed . WE logo is the same for WE-Tech, WE Air Soft, and WE Tactical International-- must be the same company?
http://www.weairsoft.com/contacts

For fun, I put 2 mags in the PA cart and the price is $69.98 + 7.99 shipping. So if I got a rifle with the old mags, it is going to cost me an additional $77.97 to get 2 of the improved "We-Tech" magazines that actually work. That is nuts. I wonder if there will be a trade back program for the early birds that got the defective magazines. Thank God I waited to see if any reports indicate problems prior to purchase. I certainly am not in a hurry with this added expense.
I would suggest it is to a point where this is a non functional BB gun as produced. When will newly designed magazines be available that should allow for a nice functional carbine? $300 is becoming a joke. A great toy, with a major design flaw. This problem with leaking & non functioning magazines will put a damper on Christmas sales of the M1 carbine. Maybe it will be a real collectable if the carbine is discontinued? :o Maybe another producer will come out with a more realistically marked, more accurate WW II version of the M1 BB or pellet carbine with a nice wood stock. There is certainly a market for one that actually functions at the $300-400 range. :idea: Heck, maybe a WW II paratrooper folding stock model. :dance: :clap:
To old to fight and to old to run, a Jar head will just shoot and be done with you.

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